13:00:13 All right, excellent. I'm going to go ahead and 321.
13:00:20 And here we are the webinar has started.
13:00:25 Right.
13:00:26 I'm going to just so that everyone knows welcome, and I will be recording well I won't be recording Merrick recording this session, I will merely be pressing a button.
13:00:37 And that recording is starting now.
13:00:39 Thanks so much.
13:00:42 Thank you. Welcome everybody. We're glad to have you here with us today for this session.
13:00:48 Just a few housekeeping items which I'm sure you've heard of many times so far but just to reiterate, we will be utilizing the live transcript for this session for accessibility purposes.
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13:01:41 This session is titled archiving. The also RANS, the value of defeated presidential candidates papers.
13:01:52 We usually focus on the winners of the presidential elections.
13:01:58 The presidential libraries of the National Archives covers administration's since Herbert Hoover.
13:02:05 The Presidential Records Act of 1978, and amended in 2014 established that Presidential Records are property of the US government and defined record keeping, obligations.
13:02:18 But what about the records that those presidential candidates who lost.
13:02:23 There's of course value and great interest in those papers.
13:02:28 Today we're going to hear about some of those candidates, including Alfred Smith, Thomas Dewey, Michael Dukakis john kerry and Mitt Romney.
13:02:53 Our presenters include Alan disclosure at Seton Hall University.
13:02:46 Autumn Hague, University of Rochester, and Michael como, Massachusetts, archives and Commonwealth University.
13:02:55 I'm going to give you a few little brief bio of each of our presenters.
13:03:01 Alan currently serves as University archivist and education coordinator for the Monsignor William know a field Archives and Special Collections center Seton Hall University.
13:03:15 He received his master's degree in library science at Rutgers, the State University of New Jersey and doctorate in honors Studies at the University.
13:03:26 He has researched presented and written frequently on various themes related to local and national political history.
13:03:36 Autumn is the Assistant Director of the Department of rare books. Special Collections and preservation.
13:03:44 The University of Rochester, where she serves as the curator for the susan b anthony papers, Frederick Douglass papers and other 19th century activist collections.
13:03:56 She has also worked at the Roxbury Community College in Boston, and the Massachusetts archives.
13:04:05 Michael is the executive director of the Massachusetts archives and Commonwealth University, sorry Commonwealth museum.
13:04:14 And he oversees the preservation and management of the Commonwealth permanent public records. As director Michael has worked to develop and implement programs and strategies to advance the archives and Museum in their mission to document preserve and
13:04:33 make accessible, the history of the Commonwealth and to expand their capabilities to meet the challenges of emerging technologies.
13:04:43 He serves as chair of the board of directors of the Northeast document Conservation Center, and as member of the Massachusetts Civil War sesquicentennial Commission, the revolution 250 forum, the Plymouth 400 Commission and the Massachusetts supreme traditional
13:05:01 traditional courts review committee. And finally, the state electronic records initiative awareness advocacy subcommittee, I should say finally I'm sure Michaels doing a lot of other things as well.
13:05:15 That's, that's our list for today.
13:05:16 And finally, to be final, I am your moderator short mill about you. And I am electronic records format specialist at the National Archives and Records Administration.
13:05:27 And now, Helen will begin with his presentation.
13:05:32 Thank you so much for that generous introduction from God, it's nice to be here with my co panelists autumn and Michael and also with each of you here today in the studio audience so to speak.
13:05:43 Well, this is a topic that's kind of near and dear to my heart because it's one of those interesting types of research phenomenon, about, you know, individuals who are seeking the highest office in the land as Andy Warhol one said, I don't believe he
13:05:57 was a candidate for the president at a point, but 15 minutes of fame that famous line in terms of being in the spotlight and really putting your self, your viewpoint in your agenda out to the public.
13:06:11 Well, I'm going to do is talk about a few of the projects I've worked on personally, but also in terms of a wider scope about research options, and some of the things that really stand out about defeated presidential candidates.
13:06:24 Okay, so no little help. Can I add, next slide or should I do it.
13:06:33 Great, thank you so much. Okay.
13:06:36 Now I put in here political Jeopardy because, unfortunately, a lot of times diffuse presidential candidates are thought of as maybe trivia question answers to trivia questions and also to varying degrees.
13:06:49 Not really put into a very public or constant viewpoint about what they did in terms of the scholarship that's out there, and how their records. Your presence and their contributions have really added so much to American history in various ways.
13:07:08 So I put down a few of the individuals who actually were serious candidates for the presidency, and you can see a very wide cross section of the population from the 17 1880s up until the present day.
13:07:23 And just some of the ones I want to give a shout out to Dan wink at Princeton who unfortunately couldn't join us.
13:07:29 But, at Princeton University there's a number of excellent papers at least Stephenson, Senator Bill Bradley, New Jersey, George McGovern who was 1972 candidate, and also socialist normal Thomas who ran six times for the presidency.
13:07:44 And also, this touches on what autumn does in her excellent work in Rochester, Frederick Douglass and his legacy in terms of American history. He ran for president as well, along with his running mate Victoria what Hall.
13:07:57 So there's a lot of individuals, everything from the progressive Robert mythology, to Outlander and of Kansas, the only republican governor, Victor.
13:08:06 Prior to a sweep of Democratic candidates during the 1930s, and the presidency of FDR.
13:08:13 And then even at the bottom. Yeah, we look at how to reach a Jew ski. You know that might sound a little odd Secaucus New Jersey hog farmer, but he had a very serious platform, of course most candidates look at lowering taxes, but his hook and his mission.
13:08:28 As a former was to have a budget, put into the American Treasury to have milk for every American youngster boy and girl doesn't matter about background, but this was his rallying point, and he actually registered 2000 votes in the 1956 election.
13:08:47 So this gives you a little perspective going from more famous to maybe more obscure.
13:08:53 And as historian kind of Thompson mentioned I put this quote in because it's really germane to what we're talking about, and it's really something to keep in mind.
13:09:05 So, as you can see American straw lessons of history. I won't read the whole thing but basically they're the failed efforts of the losing candidates still have to be remembered respected and looking forward in time, about how they neither name known,
13:09:18 but also were a legacy to those who are going to run in the present day and into the future, like, Okay, next slide from our
13:09:29 great thanks so much. Okay, and now this is these are the incentives, I just wrote down, just the primary list, there's so many ways you can study presidential candidates and how they made their name.
13:09:44 Think about it through Rivoli been 46 presidents in the history of this nation. And, you know, the number of individuals who ran for the office, either as a delegate either having the actual nomination or even trying to secure the nomination is actually
13:10:00 pretty small as well. You know, serious candidates, and as you can see here, when you're looking at the accomplishments before they ran for office and even afterward.
13:10:19 very good. If you looked at the first slide, you have to go back but there was a journalist if stone and 1940s who actually measured. Well thanks from go.
13:10:28 If you go back to the initial slide, like the welcome slide.
13:10:34 Great, thank you so much.
13:10:36 I have still basically measured the candidates, looking retrospectively back in terms of you know the value of a candidate for a particular party who may not have gotten the popular vote, or the electoral college measure to advance forward to the White
13:10:51 House. And of course, the towering figures Lincoln third from the left.
13:10:57 Wilson who's here in the center. And then even moving forward. You can see here, 1920. James Cox from Ohio and hard and you have to have a micro, you know, a basically a magnifying glass to see him in terms of his view, how they performed and what was
13:11:13 involved in terms of what their vision wise, but also in terms of how the reception wise and what kind of job they would have done for the country in their time period, and also retrospectively looking at their time period.
13:11:26 You know what was going on in terms of, you know, basically social issues, and various other things that really impacted on their duties and what they were able to do within their offices, before they ran for President.
13:11:40 Okay, show me all if we can just advance forward a few slides.
13:11:44 Sorry, this will be the last time I backtrack. Okay. Just to finish up here. As you can see here down the list, there's a lot of ways, scholars, even students who are coming new to political science, history can really embrace these particular individuals
13:12:00 who are often overlooked, as I mentioned, and can find a way to really use archival resources to put together a very unique and interesting perspective, and even at the bottom, just looking at some of the things in terms of media studies, psychological
13:12:18 profile sociology and genealogy, you know, collections are a shared experience and this is something that in terms of family history it's interesting.
13:12:27 I'll just bring up one pop culture reference which is interesting. How many people will watch the sitcom happy days.
13:12:35 I think most of you may have, or even heard about it. There was one episode called the not making of a president, which was a take on evil whites 1963 book, making a present about JFK ensure basically the plotline was rich he had met a girl who was a
13:12:53 In short, basically the plotline was rich he had met a girl who was a supporter of at least Stephenson 1956 who was running for office against Dwight Eisenhower, and this was a rematch because he ran in 1952.
13:13:05 Anyway, the storylines were interesting because his family, you know basically were staunch republicans being in Wisconsin.
13:13:12 Richie, you know, embrace Stephen said into the democratic ideal. And what happened was, you saw a lot of archival and actually icons of Stevenson's right at 56 going in this was 20 years forward bumper sticker poster kinescope of Stevenson's concession
13:13:33 speech, and various other things which were very interesting.
13:13:37 And interestingly, in the end, Richie cannot date the young lady and she said, Every time I see you I would think of my parents because they worked for Wendell Willkie, so it's kind of the same incentive.
13:13:49 This may seem a little light or flip but at the same time, it's something that shows the seriousness Stephenson was treated with respect and also introduces a whole new generation and generations to the potential of doing an interesting introspect and
13:14:05 on La Stephenson and others. Okay. Next slide please.
13:14:09 And I'm going to move along a little bit more quickly now.
13:14:12 Okay, first presidential election i just want to give you an overview, George Washington popular, father of the country and so forth. But look at the number of also RANS or candidates there were down below and even very famous names john Hancock of Massachusetts
13:14:29 Michaels area john j, you know, basically.
13:14:43 Noted judge and so forth and others john john Rutledge of South Carolina and other governors from that time period. So it gives you a sense of the starting point and even at that point, there were also individuals who did not win the office.
13:14:52 Next slide please.
13:14:53 Actually, now I always have to bring this up because Harold Stassen for individuals of a certain age, they can remember stats and running and you can see here up in the top paragraph.
13:15:04 He ran 79 times for the Republican nomination for president.
13:15:10 So he kept going very far and trying, and I know, autumn can appreciate Harold stats and because he actually tried to unseat Dewey for the Republican nomination 1948 and but you can also see that he was a man of accomplishment governor of Minnesota, President
13:15:26 University of Pennsylvania, and also did some things in the cabinet, under Dwight Eisenhower. Anyway, this gives you an archival perspective of his papers which are open, just about a decade ago at the Minnesota Historical Society.
13:15:39 So, it's a wealth of knowledge as you can see here, naval service un and some other things that he did not just remembering his defeat, but his accomplishments.
13:15:48 Next slide please.
13:15:50 Okay, I have to put Wendell Willkie in there. Because when the Wilkie it's interesting, he was the very first individual who was not a politician he was a lawyer and businessman who ran for the office and got the Republican nomination in 1940.
13:16:07 You know, product of Midwest America, Indiana, but he became a New Yorker later on in life so he does have ties to the Mid Atlantic region, and he's an interesting case, and you can see some of these testimonials here in terms of what's been written about
13:16:23 him, and what his accomplishments were, according to various experts, various literary figures and various political scientists and others who are looking back on the life of Wendell Willkie.
13:16:35 There's an excellent book by David Letterman Lewis, the historian on will keys contributions especially to the civil rights movement. He was ahead of his time in terms of supporting various equal rights causes and his book one world was a runaway bestseller
13:16:52 in terms of his look at the world and how to shape it in a better, more formative and more collaborative state. So it's one of those things that you know after he after he lost the election he really made a production and made a contribution to American
13:17:08 society and the world for that matter. Next slide please.
13:17:12 Great, thanks so much for coming on. Now of course I have to get in here in terms of finding information.
13:17:18 Now the big thing Shamil gave a wonderful overview about, you know, presidential libraries. I'll talk a little bit more about that in a moment but finding primary sources, usually the these individuals who do not win the election, have to find their own
13:17:31 repository. Logically, it could be the National Archives, many are in the Library of Congress, the main bulk of papers for Wendell Willkie for example is are at the University of Indiana which is a logical choice your alma mater or other type of repository
13:17:47 that connects to your geography or some other notable point in your life. And, of course, old school National Union catalog readers guide to periodical literature where you find these articles which are really for you.
13:18:01 Excellent detail, especially from a certain time period, and the ability to compare it to present day sources, looking back retrospectively anyway. In short, archive grid and excellent source, and not only gives Indiana University.
13:18:17 But you can see other places like the New York Historical Society and other places around the country that might have a letter letters correspondence, various individuals, everything from constituents, all the way up to other famous figures who Wendell
13:18:31 Willkie may have written to or had business with great.
13:18:36 Next slide please. Thanks so much for know, and I have to praise my co presenters.
13:18:43 Autumn and Michael we had a really nice article and the fall issue of the Mid Atlantic archivist, and also in terms of other authors. Well, myself, I did a paper in the early 2000s congressional roundtable about the feet of presidents and I did this book
13:19:02 chapter. A few years ago, on Al Smith, it's called the sidewalks of New Jersey. And basically the campaign of Al Smith in New Jersey, and how it impacted because Al Smith is the quintessential New Yorker, highly praised and highly respected especially
13:19:18 in political animals, and you probably know him maybe by the annual Al Smith dinner, which is conducted usually during a presidential campaign or both candidates are put into a banquet hall, and it's a very interesting combination of respect and also
13:19:35 learning more about you know what your platforms are and to sort of like an easygoing evening and transcripts of that. Also add to the archive while load that is out there and very important and something that can be referenced at a later point.
13:19:48 Next slide please. Thanks for not.
13:19:51 Okay. And this is just the bio of L. Smith in brief if you're not familiar, Basically he was the first immigrant candidate the first of Catholic origin.
13:20:03 You know, he didn't finish college, and he really built some self up he was like the Horatio Alger tale, for, for New York City, I mean, being born on all of our street, and so forth.
13:20:15 And actually, as part of the Tammany Hall, you know, system which was really famous in New York in terms of the Democratic Party, and what they did in terms of politics and helping out their constituencies around the city.
13:20:28 He was put into the New York assembly and from there he really shine and really took two governmental initiatives, one of his big things was the 1911 Triangle Shirtwaist fire which was tragic down around.
13:20:42 And he was big on reforms and other types of social legislation which actually connected to what FDR did later during the New Deal. For example, in general terms, and then he became governor for unprecedented for terms.
13:20:57 So his star was rising in 1928, and if we can go to the next slide.
13:21:03 He had a lot of details connected to New Jersey just being across the river, and I also want to point out a few other key figures in 1928 election.
13:21:11 Joseph Robinson was his running mate, and this was geographical balance and Robinson was considered an excellent legislator to in the senate from Arkansas john Raska was the Democratic National Committee Chairman.
13:21:25 Also, you know has a lot of connections to Al Smith back in the day. And again, Norman Thomas who was really seen as a very thoughtful voice in terms of his socials platform, other nominees included foster Reynolds, Barney and web.
13:21:39 And you have to keep in mind at this point, communism, socialism farm labor and prohibition were some of the big topics and that arrow. Next slide please.
13:21:50 Thank you so much. Okay I put this in here too. So what I found is and one of the things was context. I put that in one of my earlier slide the context is so important in terms of what these individuals did and what I found about else from this was interesting.
13:22:05 In terms of religion, in terms of liquor laws bolstered act and so forth. A lot of times, New Jersey, you know, had a reputation of not being the most straight arrow in terms of political reform.
13:22:20 I found that interesting anecdote that basically down in Atlanta county back in the 1920s, the Republican Party used to register driftwood as voters actual voters so reforms were coming in 1928, especially at this time when things were becoming really
13:22:37 serious in terms of presidential politics. And of course the African American vote was important.
13:22:44 At this point before FDR brought together Coalition's.
13:22:48 The African American constituency was mainly the party of Lincoln, the GOP, and then the women and the vote in New Jersey, a decade removed from suffrage and we're glad we have that.
13:22:58 And we're celebrating terms of various commemorations in recent years. Next slide please.
13:23:07 Thank you. I'm near the end now. And basically I just want to point out, along with primary archival documents, of course formats include letters memoranda photographs and other types of things that are important but also newspapers.
13:23:21 These were interesting, the Trenton times which is on microfilm had these wonderful out inserts advertisements from the 1920 election this was in early November, and basically they tried to do product placement, along with.
13:23:38 Are you going to vote and of course radio.
13:23:41 This was the first election that radio really played a part in terms of the debates and Smith, unfortunately didn't have a smooth voice he was more like New York, you would New York in terms of his accent, which is which is actually fine but in terms
13:23:57 of what he tried to do it didn't really register much with those across the country who aren't familiar with the New York experience and then Hoover as well was more quiet and reserved.
13:24:08 So there are a lot of facets to this campaign. I could go on but I'm just going to ask him next slide.
13:24:24 Thanks for your okay and the last part is basically, in terms of studying, especially from a political science standpoint, and also geography and also ethnicity and racial dynamics, you know, in terms of looking at County, and even tell votes.
13:24:30 You can see here, back in the day and read, Herbert Hoover Republican, he swept most of the nation, but you can see pockets where Al Smith had the majority vote and various counties for Montana, for example, sizable Irish communities in Butte and Helena.
13:24:46 And then if you go south.
13:24:48 At this point, the democrats were, you know, in the south and very formal but else with being a Catholic.
13:24:58 Against Prohibition and so forth was seen as suspect, there was a phrase in a day called a Red Dawn Democrat, and this meant that they would move for Red Dog rather and vote for a republican or some other part individual from a party.
13:25:11 But again you can see what's going here in terms of demographic breakdown.
13:25:15 Next slide please. Thanks for know.
13:25:17 Okay, this is my last formal slide. Basically, as you can see here are the actual elections in New Jersey just to give you a perspective in terms of percentages.
13:25:27 l Smith only took Hudson County, which was strongly democratic and was ruled by a man named al. I'm sorry, Frank. I am the law Hague, who ran Hudson County and was the state treasurer and was really high in terms of state and national democratic politics
13:25:44 and Hoover as you can see, took the rest of the state, but you can see how shifts were happening in terms of ethnic communities which were really important in terms of the enrichment of New Jersey and being the most densely, but also the most diverse
13:25:58 state and nation, even at that time.
13:25:59 Okay, last slide, please.
13:26:02 Okay, sorry, one more. Just to give you a sense of Bibliography l Smith has a number of books have been written about of post election.
13:26:09 Next slide please.
13:26:13 Next slide please. thank you so much. Okay conclusion sorry. Okay, and basically innate and enduring value cannot be diminished. And there's always that question in terms of history in the White House.
13:26:25 So what may have been is one of the important things that you can always look at when you're looking at defeated presidential candidates. Okay, last slide.
13:26:33 Okay. Thanks so much, and I really appreciate your time and I'm happy to turn over the podium to automate. Thanks so much.
13:26:46 Thanks everyone so much, and thank you everyone for attending today I'm going to be talking about the papers of Thomas he do he that are here at the University of Rochester.
13:26:57 So Thomas, you do he was a prosecutor. He was a district attorney, he was three term Governor of New York, but. Next slide please.
13:27:09 He was not President of the United States, despite trying three times. And so, you know, something that Alan said really kind of caught my attention, talking about, people have been defeated in their quest to become president as trivia questions and so
13:27:25 of course I had to make sure that this picture of Harry Truman, and that grin and that newspaper headline i think is kind of the main thing that people might think of if they don't know anything else about Thomas do we, you know that photo is so recognizable.
13:27:44 And the grand and Harry Truman's face and, you know, kind of ties into media reports being wrong and making his triumph, even sweeter and so I'm really happy to talk about Thomas Dewey today because Thomas do he had a really amazing career over a span
13:28:04 of 25 plus years in New York City and New York State, and he is definitely much more than his record as a defeated presidential candidate. And I'm also really excited to talk a little bit about how these records, his records came to the University of
13:28:20 Rochester and then how they're being used today because we're pretty wide range of researchers who access them.
13:28:27 Next slide please.
13:28:29 So Thomas do he was born in a small town in Michigan and was in Michigan in 1902.
13:28:36 His father ran the local newspaper, and he was a debater, and worked for the high school newspaper in high school. He went to the University of Michigan, and then came out to New York to go to law school at Columbia and really lived in New York for the
13:28:52 rest of his life. He always had offices or home in New York City and then also had a farm that he purchased about 60 miles north of New York.
13:29:02 That was really his kind of weekend retreat and he and his family spent a lot of time there.
13:29:08 He was married to Francis hut, who was a former actress. They had two sons. And so he had a very, you know, kind of loving and traditional home life, both growing up and then as an adult.
13:29:22 So after law school he began his career as a lawyer in private practice, and then started to move over into working for the government in various ways so he started as chief US Attorney for the Southern District of New York.
13:29:38 He did that for around five years, then was asked to be special prosecutor investigation organized crime in New York City and I'm going to be talking more about that position he did that for a couple of years, and then ran for district attorney of New
13:29:54 York County which is Manhattan.
13:29:55 One that, and then served three terms as New York's governor from 1943 to 1954.
13:30:02 He had three presidential campaigns to which he was the Republican nominee. So in 1940, he ran for the Republican nomination and ended up losing the nomination to Wendell Willkie who we just heard about.
13:30:15 He was only 38 years old in 1940, and as news of world war two and activity in Europe began to make its way to the United States, there was a general sense that at 38, he just wasn't old enough or seasoned enough to, to be president and so he did not
13:30:35 secure the nomination, but he was not deterred he ran in 1944.
13:30:41 One than that republican nomination but then lost the election to FDR. And then he ran again for the last time in 1940, excuse me, 1948.
13:30:49 He was predicted for most of that campaign to be the winner he was running against Harry Truman, who had become president after FDR his death, but the the polling had not been accurate and so he did not.
13:31:03 He did not win, but that was the closest of the two races that he had. And then after he left. Left Albany, after his third term as governor, he returned to private practice and so he kind of served as a Republican kingmaker to a certain sense, he supported
13:31:20 Eisenhower he supported Nixon, but it was all very much behind the scenes so he has this kind of 25 year period, roughly 1932 1955, a very intense public service, and a wide range of public rules, and then retires to private practice, you know is involved
13:31:37 in founding various law firms, and that's how he spends the rest of his, his career. Next slide please.
13:31:48 So aside from the positions that he held really he was important in a number of different ways. He achieved fame on a national level in the 1930s for his prosecution of New York City area organized crime figures.
13:32:03 He signed legislation, creating the SUNY system, the New York state's public university system, he secured funding for the New York State Thruway, which is now named after him.
13:32:13 He modernized and streamlined New York state government agencies, and you know I am not a duty biographer or do we expert but I would say that broadly you know his interest was more in policies in in sort of making government, efficient, solving problems,
13:32:32 rather than ideological he definitely had a very good eye for detail he was able to tackle some pretty big, big projects I mean something like creating a state university system and creating a statewide through a system, those are long term projects with
13:32:49 a lot of stakeholders, massive budgets.
13:32:54 In the same with his prosecution of, you know, organized crime figures he was really able to just be very, kind of in all of these situations very rugged and very relentless in in solving whatever problem was at hand and so he kind of had a reputation
13:33:11 as as a problem solver and as someone who could get things done.
13:33:16 Um, he was also the first presidential candidate to employ his own pollsters that did not.
13:33:23 In the end end up helping him win a presidential race, but it is noticeable that he was kind of future thinking in that regard.
13:33:31 Next slide please.
13:33:35 So Dewey's records.
13:33:38 There are 12 tons of them, they, they had to weigh them when they move them here to Rochester from Albany so we know that it was 12 times so an awful lot of records.
13:33:47 And so it is a really massive collection. It spans Dewey's entire life, not just his professional career, and includes you know correspondence between he and his family his parents.
13:34:02 It's over 1500 archives boxes, nearly 500 scrapbooks audio visual items and ephemeral objects, organized into 14 series, the kinds of material that you would expect to find in someone who was a major political figure so personal and professional correspondence
13:34:21 legal files, lots and lots of subject files legislation appointments related to all aspects of his work so related to his work as district attorney is rules that special prosecutor to his time as governor and his district attorney and then also to the
13:34:41 presidential runs.
13:34:43 It also includes the personal and professional records of his wife Francis, who played a large role I mean, maintain her own office, lots and lots of correspondence and public events.
13:34:55 And there is a database for this collection that can be searched in a number of different ways which does make it easier to search because it is such a substantial collection.
13:35:05 Next slide please.
13:35:08 So one question, you know, we get asked and that I certainly was curious about before I came to ur which was, you know, why are these records here at the University of Rochester.
13:35:19 Do we did not go to the University of Rochester he was not from Rochester, as far as I can tell, he didn't have, you know, any kind of relationship with the city or with the university.
13:35:31 But I think, in doing a little bit of digging I've been able to find some reasons why I think the papers came here. Next slide please.
13:35:40 So, broadly, for reasons why the papers ended up here, staff, space, faculty, and other political collections. So I'm going to start with faculty, and I think the real reason that papers ended up here.
13:35:57 You know Sharmila mentioned the National Archives and those presidential libraries, you know do he wasn't just a failed. Presidential Candidate he was also a three term Governor of New York.
13:36:09 And so, You know, there was already a system in place that was not that did not legally mandate that the State Library received his papers, but certainly the New York State Librarian at the time, was definitely a little.
13:36:22 I didn't know frustrated or upset by the fact that newspapers were not just sort of as a matter of course, sent to the State Library so he was quoted at the time is saying that you know customarily the State Library is where these papers, often go.
13:36:39 So, the democratic Chronicle registers newspaper also noted, you know that in on that action and saying you know that there's a lot of financial value to these papers and that they they belong in the State Library.
13:36:51 Well, I believe the reason that they didn't end up in the State Library is because of a history professor in was actually Chair of the Department of History here at your bar, his name was Lyndon vandalism in and Linda mentors in really wanted governor
13:37:09 Dewey's papers, so he, he started a conversation in 1950 so while do he is still governor and kind of you know basically asked him if he would consider the you have our as as a repository for these papers.
13:37:27 And so, do we ended up running for a third term. So that was kind of put on the back burner, but then when do we left office or was making plans to leave, leave office in 1954, Professor venues and started that conversation up again.
13:37:43 And I think that one of the big kind of sparks for this was in 1951, you have our receive the papers of another failed presidential candidate, William Henry Stewart, who ran for the Republican nomination against Abraham Lincoln last, and then became Lincoln
13:38:03 Secretary of State. So that is another massive massive collection of a notable us politician that that came to the University. And I think that Professor vendors and was able to point to the Seward papers, as kind of an exemplar of what could happen with
13:38:21 newspapers were they deposited given to the University of Rochester. He could point to the kinds of research that was occurring in those papers in the sewer papers and there's.
13:38:33 I'm not going to get into it too much because I want to focus on Dewey but there are a lot of similarities between the Seward papers and the Dewey papers and so I think having that as kind of an example.
13:38:43 So certainly having a passionate faculty member, you know, ask is, is one reason why the papers may have ended up here.
13:38:52 And I think that, you know sometimes people are just happy to be asked, and to have someone show some enthusiasm for their collection. Certainly, there aren't a lot of repositories in New York state that have the space, or the staff to manage a collection
13:39:08 this size and so you know venues and had had the support of the university and of the university libraries to have these conversations and so you know at the time we did have the space to take on the collection and we did have the staff in the library
13:39:24 to, you know, over time to process it and create a finding aid, and then eventually the database for it. And so, you know, as was kind of typical at this time period you know 1955, Professor been using actually assessed the initial donation.
13:39:44 They didn't bring in and outside and outside person to do that. And also governor Dewey retained control over who could access the papers, until 1972.
13:39:55 So for about 17 years if you wanted to access the papers, you had to get permission from the former governor, and we can see here on the right hand side of the screen, that the librarian at the time I Butterfield is, you know, kind of slow peddling it
13:40:09 a little bit like you know as long as you're as long as you're qualified, you're going to be able to use it.
13:40:14 I do want to know that this collection is open now to anyone that we don't know and there's no permission needed to access the collection.
13:40:24 Which is good because it's one of our most popular collections but yes, after after 1972 that went away, and the collection has been open and do he and his wife donated additional material in 1967.
13:40:38 That kind of filled out the collection even more so I don't have, you know, an absolutely bulletproof bulletproof answer as to why the papers ended up that you are but I think between the University having the capacity to take it on, and Dr venues and
13:40:54 having the kind of passion and enthusiasm and the kind of the courage to ask for it.
13:41:00 It ended up coming here, you know, at that time, it was a custom and it wasn't a law that that such papers would go to, to the State Library. And so that's how they ended up you know with with a private university in in an area of the state Pat.
13:41:18 Do we didn't seem to have a personal connection to.
13:41:21 Next slide please.
13:41:24 So we'll talk a little bit about researchers, they are numerous they are passionate, we can see in this image here, this is a telegraph relating to some communications with the Minnesota Commissioner of Agriculture, so there is no aspect of the Dewey
13:41:40 papers that has not been of interest to some researcher or another, since it was, since it was given to the bar.
13:41:49 Next slide please.
13:41:51 So, because of doing the variety of duties roles both, you know as a lawyer. And as governor, there's a lot of different aspects to his collection that people are interested in.
13:42:04 I just wanted to share some of the things that people are really like recently within the last three or four years that people have used the collection for.
13:42:13 So you can see that it's a pretty wide variety of topics but because.
13:42:29 Do we was involved in things at the state level and at the national level. It's definitely not just researchers from from New York are researching New York who are interested in him.
13:42:29 They're kind of broadly in terms of mainstream academic researchers interested, either in one of his projects proposals, something kind of concrete he was working on, or they're interested in a person that he was working with investigating.
13:42:45 You know, the cup collection just has so much correspondence. So there's definitely interest in you know him writing back to other kind of political, cultural figures of the time.
13:42:56 So really, a wide range of researchers and interest in the collection. Next slide please.
13:43:05 We've also had, you know, the, the, the researchers and the authors who are either writing biographies of Dewey biographies of people who are close to him, or indeed in the middle.
13:43:20 It's relatively new book do he defeats treatment Truman.
13:43:24 So books that are about one of the presidential runs, but I would say you know these books are, you know, these researchers, very broadly speaking, you know are doing maybe more in depth research in the collection.
13:43:39 but in terms of like how frequently, we get these sort of questions, or these kinds of researchers that they definitely make up a majority of researchers, I think there's only you know there's there's interest in the presidential runs but do is a figure
13:43:52 where you're probably not going to get a new major biography coming out every every five years or 10 years.
13:43:59 So it's definitely more kind of niche interest in one aspect of his life or work or another.
13:44:06 Next slide please.
13:44:08 And then one thing that I just love about this collection and I think really makes it unique is that by far, the greatest interest in this collection comes from people who are researching or interested in.
13:44:22 Organized Crime figures in New York, especially Lucky Luciano, but not exclusively him. And so, because of Dewey's role as the special prosecutor investigation organized crime in the 1930s 1935 to 37, um, you know that that role, got a lot of national
13:44:43 publicity, he was really seen as like this crime fighting figure as like a figure for young men to emulate.
13:44:51 And so, he, he kind of parlayed that the popularity that he got from that role.
13:44:58 And just the exposure to, to kind of further his, his career. Next is district attorney for New York County which is Manhattan in that and then for governor so it's really that work that kind of helped launch the rest of his career, and there is a lot
13:45:16 of interest, not just in sort of Dewey's role as a special prosecutor, or really anything related to the mob figures themselves. I guess I, yeah. Before I became the curator for this collection I didn't realize that this was just an area of interest for
13:45:32 a lot of people who I'm going to call, they're just they're not academic researchers there are people who are independent researchers of various stripes, who are just really interested in and passionate about learning more about the mob.
13:45:47 And so that has been exciting, and also sometimes a challenge in working with researchers.
13:45:54 You know, it's not that our rules or policies or procedures are the same for everyone but sometimes there's just a little bit more, explaining that needs to go into a conversation with someone who hasn't done archival research before and that you know
13:46:08 that holds true no matter what collection, you're looking at.
13:46:12 Next slide please.
13:46:15 So you can see here just a few things, a few topics related to the mafia that people have been interested in over the last few years.
13:46:24 Sometimes there's interested individual figures.
13:46:28 Sometimes, you know it's a little bit more complicated for example the role of the New York mafia and the Mexican illegal drug trade.
13:46:35 A lot of interest in the SS Normandy, which was a ship sunk in New York Harbor.
13:46:41 In the 1940s.
13:46:44 And so, long story short, Charles Lucky Luciano was in prison.
13:46:52 When the Normandy was sunk, and was alleged to have known something about how or why it sank. And so as investigators were looking into why the ship sunk.
13:47:05 They, they kept hearing his name and feeling that they should talk to him. And so at some point after they have a conversation with him in 1946, his sentence, which he was in prison for a term of 30 to 50 years was commuted.
13:47:22 And so he was commuted his sentence was commuted he was deported to Italy. And so his sentence was cut, you know, considerably short. And so there was a lot of kind of interest and questions about why why this was and what information he had.
13:47:37 Next slide please.
13:47:40 And so there is you we get a lot of questions there was a report that came out in 1954. So, you know, eight years after his sentence was commuted called the heroines report, and so that report was confidential at the time, and was opened, and that's really
13:47:59 kind of a full investigation into why Luciano sentence was commuted why other bad figures sentences were commuted, and that is probably without a doubt the most asked for thing in this collection, to the point in which we haven't digitized and linked
13:48:16 to in the finding itself, because it's just you know so many people are interested in taking a look at it. And so the collection overall contains correspondence about Luciano, and other mob figures.
13:48:31 There's records about him from when do he was district attorney.
13:48:35 And then we have this herlitz report.
13:48:38 And it turned out that his sentence was commuted for services to US Naval Intelligence during World War Two.
13:48:46 There's transcripts of testimony from witnesses background files on the channel so there's just a lot of information about him in this collection and I think, you know, it's been a pleasure and a surprise that that has been such a big focus of our researchers
13:49:04 in their interest in the Thomas do we papers.
13:49:08 I want to leave you with the image here. This is a document in the newspapers that I absolutely love. It's from 1937, so it's as do we is running for attorney or district attorney of New York County, so Manhattan.
13:49:24 And there's an interviewer, who is doing just knocking door to door, so really just like an early kind of campaign campaign worker who's trying to get feedback on why people may or may not be voting for for Dewey for district attorney, so they're in the
13:49:43 the Spanish fringes, which is lower Harlem. And you can see that they're telling the number of men and women, Republicans, Democrats and independents who are voting for LaGuardia, and then for doing.
13:50:12 people who are voting for him because he's on the LaGuardia ticket. And then you have 77 people who are voting for him because of his record versus racketeers. And so they're voting for him because of that, that role from 35 to 37 where he's really fighting,
13:50:18 fighting the mob and putting putting these men away in prison for you know substantial periods of time, which I know sentence was 30 to 50 years that's a really long time.
13:50:30 And then you have two people. Nobody's lost all them to vote for Dewey but to two women are voting for doing because of their husband. And then, you know, undecided.
13:50:39 You have some people who don't really know do we they don't know a lot about him and then you have some people that only vote for Democrats, not for lifelong republicans like like Duke, it was but I just think this you know speaks.
13:50:52 I love the connection between this document and how his work as a special prosecutor really kind of propelled him forward and now to today with his papers.
13:51:02 Being so heavily used but so heavily used in part because of because of that same crime fighting kind of reputation that he had. So, I love the fact that, you know, he ran for president three times.
13:51:18 He lost three times, but that his many accomplishments, whether they're from early in his career or from during his time as governor are really what the focus of most of our researchers are not all, but that you know they're they're focused on his successes
13:51:35 and his accomplishments of which they, there are many, so I will leave you with that, thank you so much. I'm going to turn it over to Michael como.
13:51:50 Okay. Great. Thanks.
13:51:51 Thanks, Alan.
13:51:53 Good afternoon, everybody. I am Michael, I'm the executive director of the state kinds of Massachusetts and it's my pleasure today to join my colleagues and talking a little bit about presidential also RANS for my presentation today.
13:52:05 I'm going to take a little bit different tack, and I like to focus a bit on the experience of my own institution and dealing with the records of the failed presidential candidates ease in real time.
13:52:14 And as that is indeed candidacies in the plural I think we as a repository have some experience to share with everybody.
13:52:21 In particular, I'm going to look at the preparation policies and methods by which we approach making these records available to a very diverse group of researchers as well some of the challenges and some of them in general and some of them are unique
13:52:33 and making this all happen.
13:52:39 And so I'm going to concentrate today on how our experience again plays out in real time. that is you know as i said well the presidential aspirins we're actively pursuing the nation's highest office.
13:52:44 I really should note that the interest in analysis of their records have long outlived their respective candidacies.
13:52:50 Next slide.
13:52:52 So let's start things off with a little bit about my own institution and his background and why we have these records here in the first place.
13:52:58 The Masters is archives located to Columbia point the city of Boston is a division of the Office of the Secretary of the Commonwealth and we fall under the Secretary's purview.
13:53:17 And his role as the state's chief elected official charged with the oversight of public records.
13:53:12 Simply put, it's our mission to collect to preserve to manage and make it accessible to permanent dog cart records of state government in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts.
13:53:20 And these records have been created really since colonial times by the legislative judicial and executive branches, the ladder which includes the governor other constitutional officers in state agencies and commissions.
13:53:32 Now it was George Carlin comedian George Carlin said in America, anyone can become president and that's the problem.
13:53:38 So as it happens a number of them came right here from Massachusetts right here from the base state.
13:53:44 The state of Massachusetts has a long and storied affiliation with the office of the president united states, we start with john adams and his son john quincy adams, we go to Calvin Coolidge to john f kennedy george HW Bush was born here and Milton mass.
13:53:57 The Commonwealth has been very well represented in the White House. And indeed We have a county of Massachusetts Norfolk County, which probably there's the monitor the county of the Presidents as four of the five Coolidge i think is the exception.
13:54:11 We're all born in Norfolk County.
13:54:16 But what we also saw our nation's highest office but came up short and Alan touched upon this a little bit earlier.
13:54:23 But it's very often.
13:54:29 Hit to Massachusetts has really, you know, made its mark and those who ran but didn't get to the final stage, if we include those candidates who's presidential ambitions did not survive the radius of the primary season.
13:54:36 We got a long list Alan mentioned john Hancock in the very first presidential election, recent memory alone office as ted kennedy Paul Tsongas Elizabeth Warren William weld developed patch of Seth Moulton among many, many others.
13:54:48 It's a very long list, indeed, but for the purpose of this discussion I'm going to focus primarily on those that served as their parties political parties chosen represented
13:54:58 here again, Massachusetts rises to the occasion. With recent party, party nominees, Michael Dukakis who was the Democratic ticket holder in 1988 senator john kerry the Democratic nominee in 2004 and Governor Mitt Romney who represented the republican
13:55:13 party in 2012.
13:55:15 And we got to all three records the document significant aspects of their public careers are on deposit right here with the Massachusetts archives.
13:55:22 As a result of their presidential candidates ease these records was subject, not surprisingly, to the enhanced interest of scrutiny expected of those who spend time in the glare of the national spotlight, with the expectation that interest in inquiries
13:55:34 would come at us from all angles and indeed that was the case, we tried to prepare ourselves, and all relevant collections to the fullest extent possible before the expected onslaught hit us,
13:55:48 the old adage tells us to the victor go the spoils, and I think Alan said this as well earlier but wants to feed it. The also ran often faced with view relegated in many cases of the scrap heap of the story of historical trivial.
13:56:00 Still now the body of archival material to those violence successful to the Oval Office represented an important resource to fully understand not only the scope but the content the context of our national political discourse.
13:56:10 They also provide us I think an instructive snapshot in time of the electorate, and the period as well.
13:56:17 The records conceptual public inspection analysis the strengths and achievements that pretty much vault of these candidates to national prominence in the first place.
13:56:25 They can also highlight the potential flaws or issues that might have precluded their ability to grasp the ultimate price.
13:56:33 Once the candidate has ascended to prominence as a major party nominee, you can expect a vast array of interested parties they'll be both pro and con to descend upon your repository to look at their records in detail.
13:56:45 These resources include members of the press that can be political operatives consultants activists, they might be representatives a special interest and in just a few.
13:56:53 And believe me, the depth and interest of the other day experience here can range anywhere from superficial to friends, really depending on their own particular state in the client.
13:57:02 Regardless, there's one thing you can be short of that they will come, they will descend on you like a school of Parana and they will devour, everything that comes in their path.
13:57:11 The challenge then for the repository is to provide comprehensive and consistent access to everybody.
13:57:26 heightened interest in activity. Now, these were indeed the challenges that we experience here in the Massachusetts archives when we made accessible the records are also RANS Michael Dukakis john kerry and Mitt Romney.
13:57:36 While the extent of records from each presidential aspect varied, the approach we employed and servicing was largely the same.
13:57:42 So the caucus who served for two terms as governor and Romney as one Trump both had executive experience. And then we're extensive records on their executive authority to be examined the email that we had relative to john kerry was a little bit less copious
13:57:55 he had served as a ton of Governor and Michael Dukakis. So the stuff is a little bit less expensive, that we have available to researchers
13:58:04 are experienced experience in servicing the records of our also RANS can best be considered by first examining what materials or obsession, as well as the expectation of the transferring authority.
13:58:15 Now in regard to government caucus into having a Romney, their gubernatorial records were transferred to the archives upon completion of their respective administrations, in accordance with the statewide retention schedules.
13:58:24 The transfer from the Dukakis administration was relatively comprehensive and there was very little if any attempt on the part of officials involved in the process to limit a shape future public access for Senate to carry the records of the archives again
13:58:35 we're limited to his tremors and ton of Governor. So, we didn't really have any extraneous issues concerning access the records document the extended carries Congressional Record, which we did not have a Washington and sit on the federal level.
13:58:49 In the case of Governor Romney, there were a large body of records transferred, but within attended caveat, the governor believed them.
13:58:57 Next slide please. And this is on the basis of an early a court decision which is really open to wide interpretation to be exempt from open access under the Massachusetts public records law.
13:59:07 Now the troublesome aspect of the romney transfer for us. Wasn't that it did not include any electronic records and usable platforms that of course on which a significant percentage of executive action adventure adventure transacting on the issue of restricted
13:59:19 access the mass market, the medical device of public records rather took a contribute to that of governors, legal, Governor Romney's legal counsel, and we made the records of administration accessible to the public wants succession by the archives.
13:59:31 Each and every box over that we received from the romney administration had a label that one to see here on the, on the slide to fix to it. So it to specific case law decision that they believed exempted them from the public records law.
13:59:43 What's more, they also use the same precedent to claim that all of the governor's records, would be likewise, free from oversight by the records Conservation Board and that's the CBS statutorily empowered body that regulates all about public records here
13:59:56 in Massachusetts.
13:59:58 As I said, the supervisor public records didn't see things the same way and these stickers they'll do whatever president, they did not shape our policy in regard to general access.
14:00:07 So the electronic records at the time of the transfer to the archives, we lock the capacity to adjust and manageable and digital content so we will probably to blame on that particular instance.
14:00:17 Today we do have a growing digital preservation instance that allows us to obsession preserve and make accessible.
14:00:22 digital and one electronic records across expansive state government.
14:00:26 When we access the records from Ronnie ministrations this capacity did not yet exist. And instead, the state's Information Technology Division was the agency that researchers had to go through they retain control of the governor's electronic records.
14:00:39 Not surprisingly, a significant percentage of the administration's substantive businesses I mentioned was conducted in electronic formats, which was a problem, and unfortunately this often lead to frustration and confusion on the part of researchers,
14:00:50 looking for access because those requesting records inspection of this material need to be redirected and very often the records were not easily retrievable by state it D.
14:00:59 In many ways, and this is, it was kind of an eye opening point for us in many ways are experienced resulted from Governor Romney's presidential one really serve as a catalyst for us to invest time and resources into creation of a digital records section
14:01:11 it's such an important part of our operation today.
14:01:17 In regard to the organization of the various series relative to our presidential also RANS arrangement was pretty consistent with the hierarchical series level structure we apply to all records meeting session.
14:01:26 From all state agencies and divisions, permanent record series or identified the Massachusetts statewide retention schedule, and under his provisions materials are accepted by the archives upon completion of active administrative use within these general
14:01:41 parameters the actual scope and content of a specific series can in many ways be largely dependent on how well you know the the creating authorities maintain materials slated for transfer, and some cases internal organization as well structured the content
14:01:51 is you know its expansive attended finding aids are robust, you know, in other cases, not so much.
14:01:58 And in the case of Governor the caucus instead of carry the materials we accession had been fairly well processed by the time they became aspirational presidential candidates for Governor Romney's administration not all serious with fully processed at
14:02:11 the time of the US. So really coordinated effort between our reference that processing stuff was necessary and essential facilitate say for handling of originals are processing stuff is often called upon to the folder every house documents, and they'll
14:02:30 when will complete processing had not yet occurred. Our approach in servicing requests and all three candidates began began with internal discussion instruction with staff on the current imperatives of security on proper handling records integrity reduction
14:02:40 reduction of information restricted by statute and or regulation and the administration and this is a really important point the administration of equitable access to all staff were alerted to be mindful of potential efforts and we didn't think this is
14:02:52 going to happen too frequently but even though it's unlikely it needed to be mentioned, we had to work on the potential efforts to present an alternative narrative by those seeking access of materials.
14:03:01 Now this is going to take in the form of either removing something from an optimal record or maybe adding something to an existing file.
14:03:07 The key point here for us, for us was to be very careful and attentive. In addition to this close attention necessary to prevent tampering. There was also the need given the increased expectation of handling the materials to ensure that no physical damage
14:03:20 actually occurred during the process. So with all of this in mind staff work to put it in place procedures and safe guys that would effectively allow us to manage this increased demand
14:03:31 entrance interviews, doesn't matter of course we conducted with each patient to assure that they understood all clickable procedures and policies before they convinced their research that was in the long run I think very very helpful.
14:03:42 And, you know, if there were any delays it helped you know our resources to understand a little bit better. While the records about presidential candidates didn't require creation and implementation of a specific measures particularly circumstances, kind
14:03:53 of like what autumn said before our policies and procedures generally applied with those in place to all of our holdings. I will say this though there was indeed an added benefit to elevating their practice in a situation of focus.
14:04:07 The volume of requests received during the election cycle of each candidate, and also made the often laborious task one that we do not love overt action even more burdensome to defend against any impression of disproportion have access to provide it to
14:04:18 a particular patriot a group, but you will always mindful of the archives reference stuff carefully cited the controlling authority under which information was with health, and then all interested parties will fully apprised of those restrictions that
14:04:39 available to them so they decided to appeal our interpretation of the law which we regularly, encourage them to do. Given the ever present possibility of an alternative interpretation of often vague and nuance legal language and for those of you who are
14:04:45 are not lawyers, you will appreciate what I'm talking about.
14:04:48 I became somewhat a matter of course for our reference staff to connect directly and often with staff attorneys in our public records division to ensure again that our own take on applied restrictions will based on a solid foundation as possible.
14:05:00 Even with all that extra effort however we did make it clear to patrons that again there was this pellet relief there if they thought it necessary
14:05:09 to ensure the original order and construct of materials wasn't disturbed, it was carefully noted and segregated the record copies inserted redacted copies in their place and as you can see here we put them on colored paper to provide a visual indicator.
14:05:21 And then we reassemble the collections once the recent all research activity had been concluded.
14:05:26 The real challenge then, here was to determine okay for what amount of time that these boxes needs to be maintained in this new artificial state.
14:05:33 So, basic baseline was the duration for particular candidacy and that that's what was pretty well but sometimes it did seem prudent to a project forward if we could, or if you needed to.
14:05:43 As an example, although Governor Romney wasn't unsuccessful in 2012 here in Massachusetts do or just ever persistent persistent rumors about running again at some future point.
14:05:53 So, in that particular case, we kind of thought that it's best to keep the redacted construct of his records in place until we felt confident that we could, you know we could, we wouldn't have been some future point go for the same effort again to the
14:06:05 same scale.
14:06:08 Once appropriately that's of course the same amended version could be provided for repeat requests, which was convenient paced patrons are also encouraged provide us advance notice of the requests, so we might be able to have whatever materials they wanted
14:06:20 is readily accessible as possible as soon as as soon as they arrived. Now this allowed us to better prepare materials and it did shorten the wait times for the researchers which I think was helpful.
14:06:30 And for many of the reasons aforementioned stuff we're very careful to document any and all activities involving these records.
14:06:38 So when the end, advanced awareness preparation, coupled with the close adherence to best practices and procedures, really proved the foundation of our approach.
14:06:47 I'll tell you this watching information gleaned from the archives pop up on the evening news or in some other public forum serves us as a reminder of why all of our effort was so important and that did happen frequently, and the ideal, you know government
14:06:59 records service and instructive measure of the purpose of structure the function of civic administration and full realization of this ideal is really dependent on collaborative relationships with creating authorities on effective appraisal and records
14:07:10 management policies, and the necessary capacity to obsession described preserve and make accessible least expansive and diverse collections.
14:07:19 In the real world, of course, doesn't always work out that way, you do the best you can with the resources that you have, which is why I think preparation and communication is so important for us, and will continue to be moving forward.
14:07:32 In our case, taking advantage of lessons learned, because remember we did have a few cracks, the same Apple we did have three candidates that didn't hurt either.
14:07:40 Nonetheless, all these components were employed at the messages sizes we made ready and available to the public records of our presidential also RANS.
14:07:50 So, including I'm going to leave you with this one last observation. In 1967, the Boston Red Sox last the World Series of the St. Louis Cardinals.
14:08:00 Now, I'm going to leave aside the irreparable scars that this horrible travesty left on my 10 year old psyche at the time.
14:08:07 And just let me know that the Cardinals with the roster full of future Hall of Famers were heavily favored to win, but in the end it was the lovable overachieving Red Sox The Impossible Dream Team.
14:08:17 That really captivated the attention not only the sports world, but the nation of lodge at the time.
14:08:21 So maybe the lesson we draw from all that is this, it is sometimes it seems the tale of the also ran it makes for the more compelling story.
14:08:32 So thank you all. It was a pleasure to present with my colleagues. Here's my contact information should anybody want to follow up with anything. And again, I thank you all for your attention.
14:08:42 And I'll turn it back to Shinola.
14:08:56 Alright, well thank you.
14:08:59 That was wonderful. And we've also had some very kind, very, you know in our chat people that said it's excellent several people Michael have loved your quote, lot of interest from that.
14:09:15 A lot of interest from that. And so let me see what questions are there was an early question from Tim Corliss.
14:09:21 I wanted to just throw out there. So, this is this for anyone to answer, would you rule out joe biden's eligibility from the also ran list.
14:09:37 We'll see.
14:09:41 Yeah.
14:09:41 I'll just say that, you know, since he won the election i think he's, He's a victor so if you didn't win because I know he ran a few other times, previous.
14:09:51 So what is one of the rest of you think that is a that's a very interesting question because of his previous attempts right so you think that yeah he does this, and it's such an interesting question which is I chuckle because as Alex I said when he won
14:10:02 this time and be a part of the country that still disagrees with that. But that's a very that's a very very good question and of course we don't know what will happen if he runs again.
14:10:11 So, yeah, we'll leave that open to future interpretation.
14:10:18 Um, here's a question about a book from Tim moats. Was there another edition of. They also ran in the 1960s update to update it to include Stephenson and Goldwater he remember seeing this book in his hometown library, when he was in high school.
14:10:39 Great, thanks for the question, Tim. Yes, actually there was a later edition.
14:10:44 So the first one was 43 and then the 1960s covering the golden wonder Johnson collection.
14:10:53 Tim actually has another question and this is for autumn about Dewey passing away in 1971, and if so, was the decision to discontinue permission to see the papers, a family decision.
14:11:08 So, that's a great question and it's not he did pass away in 1971, it's not really addressed in in our records that I could find, I think, the decision was made in advance for 1972 to be the cutoff point.
14:11:24 I am guessing, so his, his wife also his wife passed away before him. I'm guessing for the rest of 1971 maybe his sons, wouldn't you would have had to check in with his sons for permission.
14:11:37 I think there's about a nine month period there.
14:11:39 But I haven't seen anything in the paperwork that that talks about that. So I don't have a clear answer for you but I think given that it was a relatively short period of time, the question probably went to the sons to determine access.
14:11:53 Good, thank you, thank you for that answer. Um, there's a question here from john look low IQ.
14:12:00 Is there a place that one could go to where one could find a comprehensive list of presidential candidates and where those individual papers may be held and he does know that you fell in that you refer to a website that looked as he says promising.
14:12:17 Oh, great.
14:12:18 Hi john How you doing, thanks for the. Thanks for the question.
14:12:23 Right now, I haven't seen anything that's been structured, that's what that's one of my goals in the future but if somebody else can, you know, work on that that'd be great.
14:12:31 When I showed was archive grid.
14:12:34 I don't know how many are familiar but it's an excellent tool in terms of what's been processed out there, and you know it takes a few of course sessions to get each of the candidates that that might be of interest, but it's an excellent tool and it's
14:12:49 one that's not quite comprehensive yet but they keep adding to it.
14:12:54 that's not quite comprehensive yet but they keep adding to it. For those of you are familiar with it.
14:12:57 Basically if you put in the search engine archive grid one word, it should be able to come up and it has a really easy interface and usage system so.
14:13:23 But otherwise, nothing comprehensive yet that I've seen by among the search, and also on the, the effort to make one with anybody else. Thank you.
14:13:21 I have a question for Michael about the process for redactions, do you get to do you get challenges from your researchers on these reductions and maybe other challenges you might want to discuss.
14:13:34 Yeah, I mean it's not frequent, and I think a large part of that is, well, let's put it this way.
14:13:41 We kind of in sort of the the especially of the researches if it's something that we have to redacted we're a little bit sort of iffy on. We encourage them to go above our heads I mean off at the end of the day, we want to make things accessible.
14:13:54 Sometimes it's just cut and dried and the interpretations are pretty straightforward. So, if that's the case, you know, we try to let them know that there were occasions in the case of all of our also RANS that there were there were some, you know, there
14:14:07 was some questions about it and they want to go the intelligent supervisor public records and the public records attorneys were great with us and in the division of the Office of the Secretary so they helped us a lot in that regard, the supervisors the
14:14:17 ultimate authority in that regard. So if they put it forward once a supervisor is determined, you know yes or no, that's, that's, you know, who will comply with.
14:14:25 But yeah, we tried to be as straightforward as possible and as informative as possible as he could as to why we were withholding something.
14:14:32 And it's very complex and as I'm sure it is in many repositories. He was state law because of doing this whole slew of regulations and.
14:14:40 And a lot of autumn who worked here with us for a year as at the master archives can remember I'm sure fondly redacting stuff according to statute and regulation.
14:14:50 But it's not always easy for us to interpret there are certain regulations that allow the records custodian a degree of sort of leeway okay some discretion.
14:15:01 And in cases like that.
14:15:03 If we could make a case to make for a more open access we lean that way if it was something that was a little bit more, you know, a little more concrete and we would we would pass it down and say please don't just go above our heads and go to the supervisors
14:15:15 supervisors office. So yeah it does happen occasionally we never take it personally. I think that anything that gets them what they need to see provided that a comports with all you know laws and regulations and that's what we want to do we want to make
14:15:26 this stuff accessible.
14:15:29 Hey, well thank you.
14:15:30 So this question I think is for all of you, and you know if you all want to answer this fine, about, you know, some of these politicians had very long careers the sensitive information in these records.
14:15:46 And so, do you think they're complete politicians or their aides family members may be sanitized pulled records out, they don't come to the archives, ultimately, I'll jump off that for us as I'm sitting on top of that.
14:16:05 Yeah, I mean I would not be surprised the way it works here in Massachusetts is the statewide schedules terminal with series of coming here for permanent retention.
14:16:13 I wish it was sold that our records management component was more robust that we can be there with the sort of bundling together materials previous to transfer we provide guidance and assistance as requested but we can't handholds with the entire process.
14:16:26 And this is just me being cynical.
14:16:29 But I'm certain that there are things that if they are particularly, you know, volatile or toxic then there's a possibility that elements may be removed because again they come as large series will get these huge accretions from the federal government
14:16:42 offices and example. That said, the volume sometimes plays against that they're just so much stuff that will be very very difficult I think for them to catch everything.
14:16:51 So do we expect that I mean I had a wonderful question one time, and I will be I'll be these will be nameless politicians but one was sitting, sitting in office and other candidates was vying for that same office.
14:17:17 The representative that the challenges campaign came in was looking for a particular thing it wasn't there.
14:17:10 And they felt very clear this this must be there. It has to be there. Why isn't this there, you know somebody must have removed it. And I said this is the way it comes in, I should have all the documentation in the session or whatnot, but it's it let
14:17:20 me ask you a simple question. If you're a candidate when someday and something is embarrassing you think he might do the same thing.
14:17:26 And they said Point taken. And that was the end of that discussion so I'd like to think that we get most everything but I always, always allowing the possibility that human nature human nature.
14:17:38 Yeah, I can't see for sure what do we again like Michael said the sheer volume of papers, I mean 12 tons of papers.
14:17:46 It's the turnaround of the donation was was fairly quick, you know you have discussions and then all of a sudden there's trucks picking things up, but I don't have a good sense of like you know do we and his, his office and his secretaries over the years
14:18:01 as office managers, like, you know, are they are they just not putting everything into the files, I can't say I certainly think, you know, with 65 years ago that the donation, you know, we received the papers if we were receiving it today, I think that
14:18:16 you know any, any candidate or former politician in 2021 is going to be much more aware but you know a I think do we was ready to go back to private life he wasn't going to be running again he certainly could have waited until the end of his life to do
14:18:29 something.
14:18:31 Even with his personal papers, and he didn't he seemed to kind of want to make a fresh start. So, you know, we don't have any restrictions on, on the, on the papers.
14:18:42 But again, I think it's kind of a function of the time in place that the donation occurred and then, you know, we're a private institution, we're not a state agency.
14:18:52 And then, you know, 12 tons of papers, no matter how much you want to dig out, that's just too much.
14:19:05 Yeah.
14:19:01 Autumn and Michael have excellent repositories I really learned so much from each other talks were a little bit different little smaller than Rochester, We're private institution, religious affiliated.
14:19:11 And the thing is we don't have any, you know, defeated presidential candidate polka papers per se. I'll just give you a few analogies, we do have some political papers which really interesting and very detailed and valuable in terms of the content.
14:19:25 One is called the Bernard family papers.
14:19:28 He was the advisor to President Eisenhower, you know, for a number of years before he retired to run for the Senate in New Jersey.
14:19:36 And we follow any best practices in terms of archival processing, and so forth. And the thing is with our papers anything that come pretty much 95% I believe our personal papers that they donated to the university over the years, and I know their state
14:19:52 regulations, you can pay. I know Michael on already could talk more about New York and Massachusetts, but in New Jersey, certain things have to go to the State Archives.
14:20:01 If they held office in the state.
14:20:03 With that said, Just one other thing I want to connect to, you know, with other repositories and different items, you know, smaller collections even even one item or what have you, same principles apply.
14:20:17 And this is the beauty of this presentation to I'm learning from you and I think there's a lot of good questions in terms of interaction. And also, you know, cross sectioning with like major collections smaller collections just to get that sense together,
14:20:31 and this ties into John's great question about a list of all the collections out there in terms of those who were defeated but having some representation at various markets across the country.
14:20:46 Thank you. Um, there's a question here from Jessica Scott from Michael.
14:20:50 Do you have any issues with researchers trying to alter or remove records from the archives and you did allude to this in your presentation. I did and it's great question, Jessica.
14:21:01 We, I can't think I have nothing that has ever occurred on my watch here.
14:21:05 But that doesn't mean that it's not a possibility and again we make this a heightened point of emphasis, when we presented during the presidential campaigns in real time, because again it's just, it's the ultimate prize at stake here and just, you know,
14:21:19 you hear so much in the way of you know what people will do in politics. So, it was just something that we needed to be aware of. we tried to take steps and again we a normal practice obviously have everything under the supervision we have you know good
14:21:32 security measures within our public Reading Room Our staff is more interested. And you know how to make materials available to the public and to provide the appropriate amount of surveillance without, you know, overdoing it.
14:21:44 But again, the idea that something could have been added to the collection of taken away to then shape the narrative was something that we have to pay attention to because as I mentioned at the tail end of my presentation you know you see stuff pop up
14:21:57 on the news. And I can think of a couple of significant examples where, you know, there was no issue of things being added or or retracted from the collection.
14:22:05 But there was significant that really did shape the course of the presidential campaign of those of you remember back in 1988 when Governor Dukakis round against President Bush.
14:22:17 There was this whole issue with a prisoner furlough program. And it really changed the sort of the temper, of the, of the campaign discourse at that point in time, and that those materials will found in our collections.
14:22:33 So again, the possibility of what we have here shaping again the course of the election of shaping the at least the discussion to discuss within the campaign itself was, you know, really important so Jessica answer your question, there's no occasion that
14:22:48 that I can identify with that happened, but we did put whatever measures we put in place to make sure that indeed it did. So,
14:22:57 thank you.
14:22:59 We do have a question about electronic records management, what is your approach for electronic management to these politically related collections.
14:23:12 And anyone can answer this. Okay.
14:23:16 I'll just say, you know, the bulk of our political collections are pre, pre internet, so we don't have to worry about that. But we did receive the papers of local Congresswoman Louise Slaughter a couple of years ago and that contains significant electronic
14:23:33 records, so like Michael kind of using, you know, using the situation with romney to sort of develop more of a program.
14:23:41 We, there's a project archivist who's working on the slaughter papers and so he's developing a plan for those so i think that you know going forward if we acquire papers from from other more current politicians who have electronic records I think we'll
14:23:55 be able to use kind of what he's working on, and and follow up can follow his lead in terms of how to proceed.
14:24:05 Yeah it is such an important point to make sure that you can collect the materials again when we looked at we started the early stages of our own program, we thought to ourselves okay we might wind up with this great black hole, and our ability to document
14:24:17 the development of Massachusetts civic administration because we didn't have the capacity to take in a digital one electronic records. So again I did mention that because Romney was, was a was a catalyst for us.
14:24:29 We were very lucky there was a program just recently after his campaign called, I was put forth by the Council state office called the state electronic records initiative, and under the cost of a document with a very large grant.
14:24:41 We're trying to identify where we were in State Archives words best when electronic records program into to try to help them along the way and establishing something.
14:24:50 Alan yo fabulous state archivist Joe Clinton is a good friend of mine.
14:24:56 We have nothing together and we will go out to lunch and things like oh my god we got some work to do.
14:25:00 But it was very important to have that that basic infrastructure in place we've really worked at it since the first major politician that we took things in for was governor Deval Patrick who I think ran for about 15 minutes.
14:25:15 In the last presidential cycle, but we were expecting that you know if he if he had more of a viable candidate see then the electronic records will come into play.
14:25:22 So we will kindness and and being ready for that though, it never really came up and moving forward with all ages in divisions now.
14:25:29 We're trying to make sure that they're aware that we have this capacity we have this trusted trusted digital repository we can ingest we can manage. We can preserve and then ultimately make accessible electronic content.
14:25:46 All right, well, thank you so much, um, we're almost out of time, but there's a comment here by one of our attendees, Elizabeth which I think really sums up this presentation, and she says that this is a great reminder that these kind of papers are not
14:26:04 just about political history, but they also contain social, economic information, state, local history political science. And so there's a lot here that we can research and learn from and you know create that fuller narrative that we're always looking
14:26:22 for.
14:26:23 So I think that's a really great point. And I want to thank all our presenters here this was a wonderful presentation.
14:26:34 We had some great questions from the audience so really gratified to see people are interested, and are willing to, to have this conversation, virtually so to speak.
14:26:48 So thank you all.